We spoke with Dr. O.Odgerel, Associate Professor and Head of the Genetic Engineering Laboratory at the National University of Mongolia (NUM). He is a scientist who has conducted research in genetics for many years while also training the next generation of researchers. In this interview, he discusses not only funding for scientific research, laboratory equipment and research conditions, but also the shortage of human resources, the quality of basic education, and the challenges involved in preparing future researchers.

What areas of research is the Genetic Engineering Laboratory currently working on? How many researchers and students are working here?

The laboratory was established in 2012. When I told a professor I had worked with in Germany, “I will return to Mongolia and establish a laboratory at my university,” he gave me several pieces of research equipment and instruments. I brought those instruments back to Mongolia and used them to establish the foundation of the laboratory.

At the time, I was working in developmental biology at the Institute of Human Genetics in Germany. Therefore, I had planned to continue working in this field after returning to Mongolia. After I came back, I initiated several studies in human genetics, but the lack of equipment, reagents and funding made things extremely difficult. In short, the environment necessary for conducting research had not yet been established.

So, I began looking into what issues were particularly pressing in Mongolia. I noticed that the prevalence of viral hepatitis was relatively high. I therefore realized that there was a need to study the disease more extensively among the Mongolian population. As a result, I secured funding from the government, the private sector and international organizations and began implementing a number of projects.

Now, together with other researchers working in this field, we are studying the biological activity of medicinal plants found in Mongolia. At present, our laboratory has only one full-time researcher, and that is me. Institutes under the Mongolian Academy of Sciences have established full-time research positions. For example, the Molecular Biology Laboratory at the Institute of Biology has nine research staff members in addition to its head.

At NUM, however, there are only teaching positions. A faculty member is employed to teach classes and receives a salary for that work. Conducting research alongside teaching responsibilities is quite difficult. It is also unclear exactly how many people come in to work each day because most of our students come to the laboratory during their free time between classes. At present, four doctoral students, five master’s students and more than 10 undergraduate students are conducting their research at our laboratory. 

REALITY AND ASPIRATIONS MUST BE KEPT SEPARATE

Equipment is the lifeblood of research. What is the level of equipment and supplies at your laboratory?

In recent years, the situation has improved relatively well. In particular, under the “1,000 Engineers” program, NUM has acquired a considerable amount of equipment. Faculty members have also continued to implement their own projects and programs, so we no longer hear people saying, “Our research has stopped because we do not have the necessary equipment.”

However, there is no system in place to operate this equipment at full capacity and provide regular maintenance and repairs. In terms of utilization, only about 10 percent of the equipment is currently in operation, while the remaining 90 percent is sitting idle.

Ideally, laboratory equipment should be kept running continuously, operating day and night for around 10 years before being replaced with newer equipment. However, three essential factors have not yet been established as a functioning system in Mongolia: stable funding, manufacturer support and services, and a reliable supply of reagents. Even when equipment breaks down, we do not have the capacity to repair it ourselves.

Looking at the experience of foreign universities, maintenance and technical support for laboratory equipment are handled by specialized units. Where should Mongolian universities begin if they want to establish such a system?

Our difficulties would be reduced if NUM had its own workshop capable of repairing and calibrating equipment. German universities, for example, have separate units responsible for handling all maintenance and repairs. For instance, we frequently use high-pressure gas cylinders in our laboratory. However, there are very few specialists who are capable of working with this equipment.

In addition, while foreign universities can order the materials they need directly from manufacturers, we are buying chemicals at prices that are four times higher. For example, a German researcher may purchase a chemical for 10 USD, while we may have to pay 40 USD for the same substance.

There are also issues related to customs. In principle, scientific institutions are allowed to import small quantities of reagents without a special permit under a joint regulation issued by three ministries. However, customs inspectors do not recognize this regulation and require institutions to import the chemicals through companies that hold special licenses for chemical imports.

These companies take advantage of the situation and sell the chemicals at prices several times higher, which creates another major difficulty for researchers.

Why is funding for the science sector so inadequate in Mongolia? Is it genuinely due to a lack of money, or is the problem with how the funding is allocated?

First of all, the amount of money circulating in Mongolia may simply be limited. Moreover, that money is not distributed evenly throughout society; instead, it flows through only a few channels and is quickly exhausted. As a result, other sectors are left without sufficient resources.

Second, while there is some small-scale funding available, it has not been enough to bring about fundamental changes. It has merely been enough to keep things going. We need to stay grounded and distinguish between reality and aspirations. There is also a dangerous phenomenon known as institutional hypocrisy, or creating the appearance of institutional excellence without the necessary foundation. If we simply make grand claims that we are going to conduct sophisticated, world-class experiments and research, we will never be able to secure funding.

In recent years, scientists have been competing primarily based on the number of papers they publish. There is no denying that this is an important criterion for evaluating researchers. However, if we get stuck there, we will not be able to secure funding. If you talk too much about papers, your life will become nothing but paper.

Therefore, we need to combine academic research with commercial research. This is why science is internationally divided into two broad categories: basic and applied research. We need to focus on our actual needs. We can talk about impact factors, but I would like us to approach research from the perspective of its practical application and real-world significance.

WE HAVE ACADEMIC FREEDOM 

It is common for Mongolian scientists to receive funding from international organizations and foreign universities. While this provides opportunities, is there also a risk that it could affect the independence and autonomy of their research?

No. We have academic freedom. At least in my case, no one has ever restricted me by saying, “You cannot conduct this type of research.” However, there is another major obstacle. In recent years, we have increasingly seen policies that restrict international collaboration, particularly when conducting research involving human subjects.

For example, when conducting research related to human health, there are now numerous requirements in addition to obtaining approval from a medical ethics committee. For some highly specialized studies that cannot be conducted in Mongolia, we need to send samples abroad. We try to avoid sending samples overseas whenever possible, but when it is absolutely necessary, we still face numerous regulations and requirements.

At the government policy level, there also seems to be an unfounded fear that “foreigners might study the genes of Mongolians and develop biological or bacteriological weapons specifically targeting us and use them to wipe out our population.”

But isn’t it impossible to rule out such a risk altogether?

More than 350,000 Mongolians are currently studying, working and living abroad. Therefore, the genetic makeup of Mongolians is already relatively well understood. We should not restrict scientific research based on such an abstract fear.

You have devoted many years to research and have been training the next generation of researchers. Based on your experience, what other challenges are holding back the development of basic and applied science in Mongolia?

We are facing a deep human resources crisis. The number of children born each year has fallen to around 45,000. In the future, the number of university students will decline even further. As a result, universities will start competing for less-qualified applicants. The best students will continue to go abroad.

China, Japan and South Korea are admitting Mongolian students directly, even without considering their language test scores. In other words, the most talented students are being recruited by the developed countries of Asia. For example, while around 3,000 students graduate with law degrees, only about 10 graduate in bioengineering. That is an enormous gap, isn’t it? People talk about increasing the number of bioengineers, but this is directly linked to the quality of education in secondary schools. The abilities of incoming university students have declined significantly because the standards for assessing natural science subjects have fallen.

What do you think is behind the insufficient number of students studying natural sciences and engineering at Mongolian universities?

During the COVID-19 pandemic, when we evaluated textbooks used in general education schools, we found that the content of biology textbooks was genuinely poor. The images had simply been taken from Google and inserted into the books, the writing was poorly edited, and the texts contained too many words and overly long sentences.

Older textbooks, by contrast, used short and clear sentences of no more than 10 words to explain concepts. In reality, such poor-quality textbooks should be removed as quickly as possible.

In addition, we need to improve the quality and capacity of teachers being trained at the Mongolian National University of Education. Recently, we have been “producing” large numbers of teachers who do not even have a strong understanding of biology themselves, which is causing children to lose interest in the subject from an early age.

In the past, students were expected to thoroughly read and study their biology textbooks. Today, however, that culture of engaging with written texts is becoming increasingly “thinner”. It seems to be weakening not only in Mongolia but around the world.

One reason to be hopeful about improvement is that as the number of children decreases, teachers’ workloads will also decline. This would give teachers more opportunities to work individually with each student.

For a period, the quality of public schools declined significantly. What can you really teach when a class has 50 students and biology is taught for only two hours a week? In general, when basic education has fallen to such a low level, it is pointless to talk about the development of science. Education is a comprehensive concept. Yet to this day, we have not reached a common understanding of what education should encompass. Personally, I do not accept the current system and could be described as holding a somewhat radical position on the matter.

The human brain is an integrated system. Therefore, particularly at the level of basic education, it is impossible to separate academic learning from psychology. Yet today, we are categorizing knowledge as either useful or useless. I have never seen a person who is skilled but has no knowledge, or someone who has knowledge but no skills. In reality, a person who is psychologically healthy and well-prepared is better able to acquire both knowledge and skills.

Therefore, schools need to establish a strong psychological foundation for children as early as possible. Children who are patient, calm and able to concentrate are more likely to perform well at university and achieve greater success in life.